Subject: KampalaMeetingLog2014x04x03.txt
Date: April 3, 2014 3:56:29 PM PDT

[2:58pm]  HideyoImazu joined the chat room.
[3:00pm] PeterThoeny: good morning HideyoImazu-san!
[3:01pm] HideyoImazu: good evening PeterThoeny
[3:01pm] PeterThoeny: still afternoon here
[3:01pm] PeterThoeny: what's new in tokyo?
[3:01pm] HideyoImazu: ah
[3:02pm] HideyoImazu: cherry blossom went over its peak
[3:02pm] PeterThoeny: i have seen some photos of friends in japan
[3:03pm] PeterThoeny: hanami is very nice
[3:03pm] PeterThoeny: i have fond memories of hanami parties in parks in nagoya
[3:03pm] HideyoImazu: this weekend will be the last chance for hanami
[3:03pm] HideyoImazu: in tokyo
[3:04pm] PeterThoeny: sometimes hanami went a bit out of control, so much sake
[3:04pm] HideyoImazu: sure
[3:04pm] PeterThoeny: which i liked 
[3:05pm] PeterThoeny: time check: +5 min
[3:05pm] HideyoImazu: are there places near you having cherry trees?
[3:05pm] PeterThoeny: yes
[3:05pm] PeterThoeny: very nice ones in a nearby japanese garden
[3:06pm] PeterThoeny: https://www.flickr.com/photos/peterthoeny/13529359083/
[3:06pm] HideyoImazu: cool
[3:06pm] PeterThoeny: https://www.flickr.com/photos/peterthoeny/13549384795/
[3:06pm] PeterThoeny: good topic for hdr photography
[3:07pm] PeterThoeny: shall we start with the meeting?
[3:07pm] PeterThoeny: http://www.twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/KampalaReleaseMeeting2014x04x03
[3:07pm] HideyoImazu: sure
[3:07pm] PeterThoeny: 1. Feature Requests for Kampala Release
[3:07pm] PeterThoeny: 2. Extensions
[3:07pm] PeterThoeny: 3. Review Urgent and Not So Urgent Bugs
[3:07pm] PeterThoeny: 4. Miscellaneous
[3:08pm] PeterThoeny: ---++ 1. Feature Requests for Kampala Release
[3:08pm] PeterThoeny: http://www.twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/TWikiFeatureProposals
[3:08pm] PeterThoeny: we have one new
[3:08pm] PeterThoeny: http://www.twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/EncodeTypeNl2br
[3:08pm] PeterThoeny: by you
[3:08pm] PeterThoeny: 9 days ago, so accepted by 7 days review
[3:09pm] HideyoImazu: ok
[3:09pm] PeterThoeny: one question in open
[3:09pm] PeterThoeny: newline="..." parameter to ENCODE, or new type="n2br" to ENCODE
[3:10pm] PeterThoeny: which one do you intend to implement?
[3:10pm] HideyoImazu: i'm leaning toward newline="..."
[3:10pm] HideyoImazu: for consistency
[3:10pm] PeterThoeny: ok
[3:11pm] PeterThoeny: change the topic to be consitent
[3:11pm] PeterThoeny: "consitent"
[3:11pm] HideyoImazu: and INCLUDE has newline="..."
[3:11pm] PeterThoeny: "consistent"
[3:12pm] HideyoImazu: I'm going to change the topic name
[3:12pm] PeterThoeny: sounds good
[3:12pm] PeterThoeny: any other feature to cover?
[3:12pm] HideyoImazu: I haven't written up anything but ...
[3:13pm] HideyoImazu: I realized that by default I18N characters are removed from attachment file names
[3:13pm] HideyoImazu: if a file name consists only of I18N characters, only the extension is left.
[3:14pm] HideyoImazu: e.g. ".jpg"
[3:14pm] PeterThoeny: yes, thats not very usable
[3:14pm] HideyoImazu: which is weird and may trigger some "weird URL access prevention mechanism"
[3:15pm] PeterThoeny: what is the plan?
[3:15pm] HideyoImazu: if that happens, "_" will be used as the file name
[3:15pm] PeterThoeny: simple workaround
[3:16pm] PeterThoeny: longer term it is better to fully support i18n chars in attachments
[3:16pm] PeterThoeny: (in attachment names)
[3:16pm] HideyoImazu: as far as I tested, at least on Linux, there doesn't seem to be a lot of problem 
allowing i18n chars in attachments
[3:17pm] HideyoImazu: so i plan to introduce {AllowI18NCharsInFileName} or something alike
[3:17pm] HideyoImazu: which is false by default
[3:17pm] HideyoImazu: that way, I can experiment
[3:18pm] PeterThoeny: which could be a resonable known limitation for twiki's server requirement when 
using i18n
[3:19pm] HideyoImazu: anyway, these are regarded as "no brainer" fix/enhancement, I suppose
[3:19pm] HideyoImazu: no impact to existing installation by default
[3:20pm] PeterThoeny: to plan for additional i18n configuration maybe call it {I18N}{EnableAttachments} 
or the like
[3:20pm] HideyoImazu: ok
[3:21pm] PeterThoeny: ---++ 2. Extensions
[3:21pm] PeterThoeny: http://www.twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/WebChanges
[3:22pm] PeterThoeny: new plugin:
[3:22pm] PeterThoeny: http://www.twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/CopyTopicTreePlugin by me
[3:22pm] PeterThoeny: thanks to sponsorship by canadian power utility company
[3:22pm] HideyoImazu: you advertised it on Twitter
[3:22pm] PeterThoeny: yep
[3:22pm] PeterThoeny: did you see the spec?
[3:23pm] PeterThoeny: use case:
[3:23pm] PeterThoeny: i am working on a relatively complex twiki app to support investigations of power 
utilities
[3:23pm] HideyoImazu: i haven't looked into it yet
[3:24pm] PeterThoeny: problems can be quite complex and difficult to diagnose
[3:24pm] PeterThoeny: so they have so called decision trees
[3:24pm] PeterThoeny: a decision tree has hypothesis that are proved or disproved
[3:25pm] PeterThoeny: each node has two new child nodes
[3:25pm] PeterThoeny: e.g. whole tree
[3:25pm] PeterThoeny: somepne with experience creates a decision tree
[3:25pm] PeterThoeny: then users when faced with an issue can grab one of the decision trees to run a 
trial in an investigation
[3:26pm] PeterThoeny: so for this i need to copy a whole decision tree, e.g. instanciate it as an object
(if you look at a decision tree as a class)
[3:27pm] PeterThoeny: simple copy is not enough, you need to change the topic names based on an algorithm
to avoid name clashes on copy,
[3:27pm] PeterThoeny: and you need to set/change some form fields
[3:27pm] PeterThoeny: i created the CopyTopicTreePlugin supprting this need
[3:28pm] PeterThoeny: luckily the power utility agreed to opensource the plugin
[3:28pm] HideyoImazu: I wonder if the copy script can be enhanced accordingly
[3:28pm] PeterThoeny: so i wrote it in a generic way so that it hopefully can be used for other use cases
[3:28pm] PeterThoeny: i don't use the copy script
[3:28pm] PeterThoeny: all done in plugin code
[3:29pm] HideyoImazu: I know
[3:29pm] HideyoImazu: so i'm wondering
[3:29pm] PeterThoeny: there is one part where api is not sufficient, so i use internal call for just that
one part
[3:29pm] PeterThoeny: ah, you mean enhance the copy script to optionally copy also all children?
[3:30pm] HideyoImazu: that's right. we have "More topic actions ..." -> Copy topic
[3:30pm] HideyoImazu: if that page has "copy its descendants" check box
[3:30pm] HideyoImazu: that would be cool
[3:31pm] PeterThoeny: yes, checkboxes would be cool for descendants
[3:31pm] HideyoImazu: once in a while I get request/question about that
[3:32pm] PeterThoeny: confluence has an extension for that:
[3:32pm] PeterThoeny: https://marketplace.atlassian.com/plugins/com.nurago.confluence.plugins.treecopy
[3:32pm] PeterThoeny: can be used for inspiration
[3:34pm] PeterThoeny: http://www.twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/DateTimePlugin - update by you
[3:34pm] HideyoImazu: it would be even cooler if the descendants are listed when you check the "copy
descendants" and you can uncheck topics you don't want to copy
[3:34pm] PeterThoeny: yes
[3:35pm] PeterThoeny: wondering if better to enhance copy script or plugin
[3:35pm] PeterThoeny: i have a hunch that ui is easier done with the plugin, boiler code is in
[3:36pm] PeterThoeny: http://www.twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/SyntaxHighlightingPlugin - updated by you
[3:36pm] PeterThoeny: thanks for fixing it
[3:37pm] HideyoImazu: np
[3:37pm] PeterThoeny: the automatic detecion worked on my version of enscript
[3:37pm] HideyoImazu: just scratched my own back
[3:37pm] PeterThoeny: good to have it support other output of enscript
[3:38pm] PeterThoeny: http://www.twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/LdapNgPlugin - updated by you
[3:38pm] PeterThoeny: http://www.twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/PreferencesPlugin - by me
[3:38pm] PeterThoeny: fixed issue with edit button label
[3:39pm] PeterThoeny: that is all on extensions
[3:39pm] PeterThoeny: anything else on them?
[3:39pm] HideyoImazu: no
[3:39pm] PeterThoeny: ---++ 3. Review Urgent and Not So Urgent Bugs
[3:39pm] PeterThoeny: http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/WebChanges
[3:40pm] PeterThoeny: vicki brown posted an intersting request:
[3:40pm] PeterThoeny: develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item7475
[3:40pm] PeterThoeny: Extend Value of AllAuthUsersGroup with associated variable
[3:40pm] PeterThoeny: http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item7475
[3:41pm] PeterThoeny: a new %ALLAUTHUSERS% variable
[3:41pm] PeterThoeny: i asked her to post a feature request
[3:41pm] PeterThoeny: i have no other bug items to discuss
[3:42pm] PeterThoeny: anything?
[3:42pm] HideyoImazu: no
[3:42pm] PeterThoeny: --- 4. Miscellaneous
[3:42pm] PeterThoeny: anything?
[3:42pm] HideyoImazu: no
[3:42pm] PeterThoeny: i'll be in hong kong on next meeting
[3:43pm] PeterThoeny: not sure if i can get up at 6am 
[3:43pm] HideyoImazu: I got up 5:30 am today to get on a 6:00 am train
[3:43pm] PeterThoeny: i will send the invite, but i can't promise to participate
[3:44pm] HideyoImazu: to get to the office by 7:00
[3:44pm] PeterThoeny: wow, very early
[3:44pm] HideyoImazu: trains not crowded, run faster in the early morning
[3:45pm] HideyoImazu: if you remember what commuter trains are like in big cities in Japan
[3:45pm] PeterThoeny: one fyi
[3:45pm] PeterThoeny: yes, i remember
[3:46pm] PeterThoeny: that's why i commuted by bicycle most of the time in nagoya
[3:46pm] PeterThoeny: on monday i met a founder of a silicon valley startup
[3:47pm] PeterThoeny: they have an early version of mobile app to get & discuss feedback & ideas from
employees
[3:47pm] PeterThoeny: https://www.nextinit.com/login.jsp
[3:47pm] PeterThoeny: looks very user friendly
[3:48pm] PeterThoeny: they use gamification to get more users involved
[3:48pm] PeterThoeny: for example, use virtual money you can invest in ideas
[3:48pm] PeterThoeny: ideas that have most investments are more important
[3:49pm] PeterThoeny: this is just fyi, showing some useful app
[3:50pm] HideyoImazu: interesting
[3:51pm] HideyoImazu: shall we wrap it up?
[3:51pm] PeterThoeny: yes
[3:51pm] PeterThoeny: i'll post the logs
[3:51pm] PeterThoeny: ttyl hideyo-san!
[3:52pm] HideyoImazu: ttyl peter
[3:52pm] HideyoImazu: have a safe trip to hong kong!
[3:52pm]  HideyoImazu left the chat room. ("Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com")