Date: June 21, 2012 10:36:46 PM PDT
Subject: JerusalemMeetingLog2012x06x22.txt

[8:48pm]  himazu joined the chat room.
[8:54pm]  tyatpi joined the chat room.
[9:00pm] PeterThoeny: hi himazu-san, hi tyatpi
[9:02pm] PeterThoeny: tyatpi is Tyler Slijboom?
[9:02pm] himazu: hi Peter
[9:02pm] tyatpi: yes
[9:02pm] tyatpi: Hello
[9:02pm] PeterThoeny: nice to meet you here tyler
[9:02pm] himazu: hi Tyler. good to see you.
[9:03pm] PeterThoeny: let's see who else shows up
[9:03pm] PeterThoeny: himazu-san, you had a typhoon in japan
[9:03pm] PeterThoeny: was it ok, not too bad?
[9:04pm] himazu: it wasn't so awful in tokyo.
[9:04pm] himazu: there were some fatalities other parts of japan
[9:04pm] PeterThoeny: oh
[9:05pm] PeterThoeny: i have seen that ana had a hard landing in narita
[9:05pm] PeterThoeny: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YorADRNEqt8
[9:06pm] himazu: the airplane was damaged.
[9:07pm] himazu: i wonder how it can be fixed - the body got wobbles.
[9:07pm] PeterThoeny: possibly totaled
[9:07pm] PeterThoeny: i don't think it can be fixed
[9:07pm]  MichaelGulitz joined the chat room.
[9:07pm] himazu: hopefully covered by insurance
[9:08pm] PeterThoeny: guten morgen michael!
[9:08pm] PeterThoeny: early for you!
[9:08pm] PeterThoeny: time check: +8 min
[9:08pm] PeterThoeny: let's start
[9:08pm] MichaelGulitz: just came from bed  good morning everybody
[9:08pm] PeterThoeny: we have folks who do not know each other
[9:09pm] PeterThoeny: so please do a short intro who you are and what you use twiki for
[9:09pm] PeterThoeny: in mean time i post agenda
[9:09pm] PeterThoeny: minutes at
http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/JerusalemReleaseMeeting2012x06x22
[9:09pm] PeterThoeny: proposed agenda:
[9:09pm] PeterThoeny: 1. Feature Requests for Jerusalem Release
[9:09pm] PeterThoeny: 2. Review Urgent and Not So Urgent Bugs
[9:09pm] PeterThoeny: 3. TWiki Foundation Discussion
[9:09pm] PeterThoeny: 4. Miscellaneous
[9:10pm] himazu: i've been managing twiki for morgan stanley. a single twiki site having 6000+ webs.
[9:10pm] PeterThoeny: we can add additional item to agenda, just speak up
[9:11pm] MichaelGulitz: I work at a consulting and software company in germany. We use twiki 
internally but also in customer projects in combination with our own product
[9:11pm] PeterThoeny: i am trying to increase the size of the community, and i am doing mainly
consulting now (lots of twiki stuff)
[9:12pm] PeterThoeny: MichaelGulitz:  strong coffee wakes you up in early morning
[9:12pm] PeterThoeny: tyatpi?
[9:13pm] PeterThoeny: ---++ 1. Feature Requests for Jerusalem Release
[9:14pm] PeterThoeny: proposals at
[9:14pm] PeterThoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/TWikiFeatureProposals
[9:14pm] PeterThoeny: i only have one i'd like to discuss & also vote on:
[9:14pm] PeterThoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/ConfigurableAttachmentNameBehavior
[9:15pm] PeterThoeny: himazu-san: do you want to discuss RepositoryForSiteAndWebMetadata too?
[9:15pm] tyatpi: I am just a fan of the Twiki, I use it for Knowledge transfer where I work
[9:16pm] PeterThoeny: on ConfigurableAttachmentNameBehavior, the spec changed two times back and
forth
[9:16pm] PeterThoeny: we have users who one one behavior and other users the other behavior
[9:16pm] himazu: i have no particular point to discuss on the metadata repository
[9:16pm] PeterThoeny: therefore i recommend to support both
[9:17pm] PeterThoeny: with a configure setting to use one or the other
[9:17pm] himazu: if there is some concerns or questions, they are welcome though.
[9:17pm] PeterThoeny: default is current behavior
[9:17pm] MichaelGulitz: sounds like a good idea
[9:17pm] himazu: i second
[9:17pm] PeterThoeny: ok, so that is the vote
[9:18pm] PeterThoeny: tyatpi:  cast your vote if you like
[9:18pm] PeterThoeny: we have three documented was to get feature proposals accepted:
[9:18pm] PeterThoeny: 1. seven day review period
[9:18pm] PeterThoeny: 2. vote at release meeting
[9:19pm] PeterThoeny: 3. consensus
[9:19pm] PeterThoeny: this is for regular features
[9:19pm] PeterThoeny: we also have so called "no-brainer" features that do not need to go through
the format process
[9:20pm] PeterThoeny: himazu-san: i have no questions at this time on the metadata repository
[9:20pm] PeterThoeny: i have replied to an e-mail today, have you seen himazu-san?
[9:20pm] himazu: sure.
[9:21pm] himazu: i'm thinking about it and will soon reply with a concrete proposal.
[9:22pm] PeterThoeny: we have not heard from tyatpi, but with my yes vote the feature is accepted
by vote on today's release meeting
[9:22pm] himazu: in any case before I made the change, if login and cUID are different,
renderRevisionInfo() was behaving strangely.
[9:22pm] PeterThoeny: himazu-san, i recommend to update the feature proposal topic and discuss
there in public
[9:22pm] tyatpi: I apologize, I am trying to get a better sense of the items.
[9:23pm] himazu: ok
[9:23pm] PeterThoeny: np tyatpi
[9:23pm] himazu: let met rever the change and write up a proposal.
[9:23pm] PeterThoeny: any other feature to mention or dicuss?
[9:23pm] PeterThoeny: "discuss"
[9:23pm] himazu: rather, I put my proposal to the bugs item.
[9:24pm] PeterThoeny: more eyes are on codev web
[9:25pm] PeterThoeny: so it might be better to discuss in proposal topic
[9:25pm] himazu: ok
[9:25pm] PeterThoeny: ---++ 2. Review Urgent and Not So Urgent Bugs
[9:25pm] himazu: i'll create a proposal.
[9:25pm] PeterThoeny: i have no urgent bugs to discuss
[9:26pm] PeterThoeny: himazu-san: could be a new proposal, or simply an update to the existing
proposal
[9:26pm] PeterThoeny: whatever is easier for you
[9:26pm] himazu: sure
[9:27pm] MichaelGulitz: There are interisting comments on
http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/SearchEngineKinoSearchAddOnDev for using apache Tika as
stringifier
[9:27pm] PeterThoeny: no urgent bugs,
[9:27pm] PeterThoeny: ah, i have seen that comment
[9:27pm] MichaelGulitz: There is currently no working solution for searching attachments
[9:27pm] MichaelGulitz: this mightbean interisting way
[9:27pm] PeterThoeny: well, with kinosearch there is, but installation is a drag
[9:28pm] PeterThoeny: and it is not so well integrated into twiki
[9:28pm] MichaelGulitz: and the CPAN does no longer fit to the implementation
[9:28pm] PeterThoeny: yea, this add-on needs some tlc
[9:29pm] MichaelGulitz: I think searching attachments is still an important feature
[9:29pm] PeterThoeny: yes it is
[9:30pm] PeterThoeny: ideally twiki would support that natively
[9:30pm] MichaelGulitz: that would be the best
[9:30pm] PeterThoeny: but that would require lots of stringifiers in perl
[9:31pm] MichaelGulitz: the apache module tika seems to be able to do all the stringifying
[9:31pm] PeterThoeny: yes, and it requires a jvm
[9:32pm] PeterThoeny: which is ok for an add-on, but would raise the required env for core twiki
too much
[9:32pm] PeterThoeny: back to bugs/no brainers, a few i;d like to mention
[9:32pm] MichaelGulitz: i get the point
[9:32pm] PeterThoeny: Item6885: Support HTML and MIME Multi-Part E-mail Messages
[9:33pm] PeterThoeny: http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item6885
[9:33pm] PeterThoeny: i did this enhancement, was requested by nist
[9:33pm] PeterThoeny: Item6888: Add # character to {NameFilter}
[9:33pm] PeterThoeny: http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item6888
[9:33pm] PeterThoeny: tiny fix that was lingering for a long time
[9:34pm] PeterThoeny: Item6890: Multi-value parameters lost during login redirect
[9:34pm] PeterThoeny: http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item6890
[9:34pm] PeterThoeny: i just fixed that yesterday
[9:34pm] PeterThoeny: i created a twiki app for a client
[9:34pm] PeterThoeny: they discovered a bug
[9:35pm] PeterThoeny: when a user was not authenticated and updated the membership list in a
topic, all members were removed except for the first one
[9:35pm] PeterThoeny: caused by a core bug
[9:35pm] PeterThoeny: was difficult to debug due to several redirects during login
[9:35pm] PeterThoeny: Item6889: TWiki::Render::renderRevisonInfo() incorrectly handling cUID
[9:36pm] PeterThoeny: http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item6889
[9:36pm] PeterThoeny: himazu-san, i send reply today
[9:36pm] PeterThoeny: i recommend to consider the corner cases
[9:36pm] himazu: sure
[9:37pm] PeterThoeny: Item6891: LdapContrib to support GSSAPI mechanism for SASL authentication
[9:37pm] PeterThoeny: http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item6891
[9:37pm] PeterThoeny: thank you himazu-san for working on this
[9:37pm] himazu: np
[9:37pm] himazu: as you can imagine, it's to scratch my itch.
[9:38pm] PeterThoeny: once finished i recommend to update the plugin topic with history, and to
release it
[9:38pm] himazu: ok.
[9:38pm] PeterThoeny: if you want i can do that
[9:38pm] himazu: please
[9:38pm] PeterThoeny: but it would be good learning experience for you to upload a plugin
[9:39pm] himazu: ah
[9:39pm] PeterThoeny: via build script
[9:39pm] himazu: let me try
[9:39pm] PeterThoeny: all automated
[9:39pm] himazu: i'll do other contrib/plugin updates.
[9:39pm] PeterThoeny: so, update plugin topic with new relase number and new line in history
[9:39pm] himazu: ok
[9:39pm] PeterThoeny: update .pm file with new release number
[9:40pm] PeterThoeny: cd lib/TWiki/Contrib/LdapContrib
[9:40pm] PeterThoeny: ./build.pl upload
[9:40pm] PeterThoeny: that;s it
[9:41pm] PeterThoeny: you might need to set an env variable for build
[9:41pm] himazu: all right. thank you for the instruction!
[9:42pm] PeterThoeny: with the build script it is very quick to do an update and new release
[9:42pm] PeterThoeny: Item6878: New {Ldap}{CaseSensitiveLogin} setting
[9:42pm] PeterThoeny: http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item6878
[9:42pm] PeterThoeny: i think i did that one shortly after our previous meeting
[9:43pm] PeterThoeny: that is all i have on bugs
[9:43pm] PeterThoeny: any other item?
[9:45pm] PeterThoeny: himazu-san: let me know if you want me to update the contrib this time, or
if you want to do
[9:46pm] himazu: I'll do
[9:46pm] PeterThoeny: ok
[9:46pm] PeterThoeny: ---++ 3. TWiki Foundation Discussion
[9:46pm] PeterThoeny: we have no progress on this front for a while
[9:46pm] PeterThoeny: i'd like to have george involved in this
[9:46pm] PeterThoeny: first step to do survey
[9:46pm] PeterThoeny: i'll ping george
[9:47pm] PeterThoeny: any comments on foundation?
[9:48pm] PeterThoeny: if not, let's go to next item
[9:48pm] PeterThoeny: ---++ 4. Miscellaneous
[9:49pm] PeterThoeny: anything?
[9:49pm] PeterThoeny: i have one item, but first, anybody else?
[9:50pm] MichaelGulitz: What about using google+
[9:50pm] MichaelGulitz: a twiki site in google+ might help getting ne people involved
[9:51pm] PeterThoeny: MichaelGulitz:  i registered as a g+ user but am not active
[9:51pm] PeterThoeny: feel free to drive the twiki page on g+
[9:51pm] PeterThoeny: this is a good idea
[9:52pm] PeterThoeny: any new channel that helps promote twiki is good
[9:52pm] himazu: maybe that motivates me to use g+
[9:52pm] PeterThoeny: me too
[9:52pm] PeterThoeny: so far i have not seen a good reason to do less in fb and more in g+
[9:53pm] MichaelGulitz: There other open source projects on g+. I'll gather some ideas...
[9:53pm] PeterThoeny: on fb we have a group for twiki
[9:53pm] PeterThoeny: but some time ago fb changed the group format
[9:54pm] PeterThoeny: groups were migrated, but _without users_
[9:54pm] PeterThoeny: we have several hundred users, not only a handful
[9:54pm] himazu: oh
[9:54pm] PeterThoeny: and no way to contact the previous members
[9:54pm] PeterThoeny: i don;t know what kind of brain fart that was by fb
[9:55pm] PeterThoeny: anyway, i think a twiki page is better than a group
[9:55pm] PeterThoeny: i'll create a fb page for twiki
[9:55pm] PeterThoeny: MichaelGulitz:  yes, please do whatever needed for twiki on g+
[9:56pm] PeterThoeny: in e-mail you mentioned g+ for our release meetings
[9:56pm] PeterThoeny: how would that work?
[9:58pm] MichaelGulitz: +g hangouts - scheduled public online sessions via chat and/or webcam, have
not tried it yet
[9:59pm] MichaelGulitz: but i don't know if there is a log function you can review later on
[10:00pm] PeterThoeny: ok, needs some investigation
[10:00pm] PeterThoeny: i have one item:
[10:00pm] PeterThoeny: we should plan for next release
[10:00pm] MichaelGulitz: baciscally hangouts are scheduled and published and anybody interested can
take part, but can also be rstricted to certain circles
[10:01pm] PeterThoeny: usually we have yearly production releases
[10:01pm] PeterThoeny: so it is time for a release
[10:01pm] PeterThoeny: not strictly 12 month, so some delay is ok
[10:02pm] PeterThoeny: i recommend we plan for september release
[10:02pm] PeterThoeny: that gives us some time
[10:02pm] PeterThoeny: for each release it is good to have a few noteworthy enhancements
[10:03pm] PeterThoeny: we need a few more features in this deparmtnet
[10:03pm] PeterThoeny: one i'd like to finish is initial app packaging standard and simple app store
[10:03pm] PeterThoeny: what features do you think important/good for upcoming production release?
[10:04pm] himazu: it would be great if we can put large site features.
[10:06pm] MichaelGulitz: CombineJumpBoxAndSearchBox would be nice - some user get irritated by the
two boxes
[10:06pm] PeterThoeny: agreed on both
[10:07pm] MichaelGulitz: TopicDisplayName might also be good new feature
[10:07pm] PeterThoeny: himazu-san, think of initial feature set you want to have and plan to have
it ready by early september
[10:07pm] PeterThoeny: MichaelGulitz:  those two i plan to finish
[10:07pm] himazu: ok
[10:08pm] PeterThoeny: but they are not "wow" items
[10:08pm] PeterThoeny: bit site support is, app packaging standard & app store is
[10:09pm] PeterThoeny: think of other "wow" features that would be good to have in new release
[10:09pm] PeterThoeny: can be a new feature or an existing proposed feature
[10:10pm] PeterThoeny: ok, this is all i have for now
[10:10pm] PeterThoeny: anything else?
[10:11pm] himazu: not from me
[10:11pm] PeterThoeny: time check: +71min
[10:11pm] MichaelGulitz: no
[10:11pm] PeterThoeny: ok, let's close the meeting
[10:11pm] PeterThoeny: thanks all!
[10:11pm] PeterThoeny: i'll post the minutes
[10:11pm] MichaelGulitz: have nice day!
[10:11pm] PeterThoeny: ttyl
[10:12pm] himazu: have a good one
[10:12pm] MichaelGulitz: bye
[10:12pm]  MichaelGulitz left the chat room.
[10:12pm]  himazu left the chat room. (Quit: Page closed)