Date: December 15, 2011 10:40:05 PM PST
Subject: JerusalemMeetingLog2011x12x16.txt

[8:28pm] himazu joined the chat room.
[8:41pm] GeorgeTrubisky joined the chat room.
[8:49pm] himazu left the chat room. (Ping timeout:  276 seconds)
[8:59pm]GeorgeTrubisky: Hi Peter
[8:59pm]PeterThoeny: hi george!
[9:00pm]PeterThoeny: hideyo-san was here 10 min ago
[9:00pm]GeorgeTrubisky: yes, just a timeout I think
[9:00pm]PeterThoeny: lets see when he is coming back
[9:01pm]PeterThoeny: any plans for the long winter break?
[9:01pm]GeorgeTrubisky: yes, I'm taking the christmas and newyear weeks off
[9:02pm]GeorgeTrubisky: hosting christmas, will be down in LA (burbank) the week after
[9:02pm]GeorgeTrubisky: I can still do a release meeting on the 29th if you want
[9:02pm]GeorgeTrubisky: how about you?
[9:03pm]PeterThoeny: not totally fixed yet
[9:04pm]PeterThoeny: my mom is coming over from switzerland
[9:04pm]PeterThoeny: we go to reno for skiing after xmas for a few days
[9:04pm]GeorgeTrubisky: wow.  she ever been in the US?
[9:04pm]PeterThoeny:2nd time
[9:04pm]GeorgeTrubisky: great
[9:04pm]PeterThoeny: she was here may be 8 years ago
[9:06pm]PeterThoeny: hmm, wondering if hideyo-san is coming back
[9:08pm]PeterThoeny: lets give it 2 more min
[9:08pm] himazu joined the chat room.
[9:08pm]himazu: are you there, Peter?
[9:08pm]PeterThoeny: hi hideyo-san!
[9:09pm]PeterThoeny: yes, george and i are here
[9:09pm]PeterThoeny: how is japan? getting cold?
[9:09pm]GeorgeTrubisky: hi himazu
[9:09pm]himazu: it is.
[9:10pm]PeterThoeny: on my iphone i see that naoya currently has 8 centigrade
[9:10pm]himazu: hi george
[9:11pm]PeterThoeny: we have about the same in cupertino (in evening now)
[9:11pm]GeorgeTrubisky: yes, cold this week
[9:11pm]PeterThoeny: time check:  +11 min
[9:11pm]PeterThoeny: only 3 of us this time
[9:11pm]PeterThoeny: i suggest we start
[9:11pm]PeterThoeny:1. Feature Requests for Jerusalem Release
[9:11pm]PeterThoeny:2. Review Urgent and Not So Urgent Bugs
[9:11pm]PeterThoeny:3. Miscellaneous
[9:11pm]PeterThoeny: anything to add to agenda?
[9:12pm]GeorgeTrubisky: stuff I have will fit under 2
[9:12pm]PeterThoeny: ok
[9:12pm]PeterThoeny: ---++ 1. Feature Requests for Jerusalem Release
[9:12pm]PeterThoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/TWikiFeatureProposals
[9:13pm]PeterThoeny: let's make this short, and skip those we discussed last time
[9:13pm]PeterThoeny: looking for hideo-san's proposal
[9:13pm]PeterThoeny: not in the list
[9:14pm]PeterThoeny: sorry, i meant hideyo-san
[9:15pm]PeterThoeny: found it
[9:15pm]PeterThoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/MakeClearAttachmentsAreVersioned
[9:15pm]PeterThoeny: himazu:  do you want to commit to implement this feature?
[9:15pm]PeterThoeny: if so, set the appropriate fields
[9:16pm]PeterThoeny: i think this is a small enough proposal, good to familiarize yourself
with our release process
[9:16pm] himazu left the chat room. (Ping timeout:  240 seconds)
[9:16pm]GeorgeTrubisky: ops
[9:17pm]PeterThoeny: hmm, he has connection issue
[9:17pm]GeorgeTrubisky: looks good to me
[9:17pm]PeterThoeny: yes, looks good
[9:17pm]PeterThoeny: ok, let's go to next one and come back once he is back
[9:18pm]GeorgeTrubisky: so emptytrash is taken by SergeiHaramundanis
[9:18pm]PeterThoeny: yes
[9:18pm]GeorgeTrubisky: he only asked for plug-in update
[9:19pm]PeterThoeny: i proposed a new feature:
[9:19pm]PeterThoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/NewAutoModeForTwisty
[9:19pm]PeterThoeny: we had a bug report that was not really a bug because it is documented
behaviour
[9:19pm]PeterThoeny: nevertheless it is a usability issue
[9:19pm]PeterThoeny: twisties do not always work as one would expect
[9:20pm]PeterThoeny: this proposal makes twisties behave asone would expect
[9:20pm]PeterThoeny: i looked into the code, implementation seems to be a bit complex
[9:21pm]PeterThoeny: issue is mode="span" (default) vs mode="div"
[9:21pm]PeterThoeny: have you seen?
[9:22pm]PeterThoeny: i probably need to use a post variable expansion handler to determine
which mode to use on auto mode
[9:22pm]PeterThoeny: any feedback on this proposal?
[9:23pm]GeorgeTrubisky: bit above me, sorry
[9:23pm]PeterThoeny: np on implementation
[9:23pm]PeterThoeny: that is all on feature proposals on my side
[9:23pm]PeterThoeny: do you have anything?
[9:24pm]GeorgeTrubisky: not on features, no
[9:24pm]PeterThoeny: ---++ 2. Review Urgent and Not So Urgent Bugs
[9:24pm]PeterThoeny: http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/ReleaseBlocker
[9:24pm]PeterThoeny: anything you want to cover?
[9:24pm]GeorgeTrubisky: yes
[9:25pm]GeorgeTrubisky: last meeting, 58 unit test were broken in the trunk
[9:25pm]GeorgeTrubisky: today its up to 106
[9:25pm]PeterThoeny: i fixed an issue or two
[9:25pm] himazu joined the chat room.
[9:26pm]PeterThoeny: yes, i still have not found the time to debug the form change changes i did
[9:26pm]PeterThoeny: i am pretty sure the issue is in the twikiforms handling change
[9:26pm]GeorgeTrubisky: this? MoveChangeFormFromEditToMoreScreen
[9:26pm]PeterThoeny: did you also run in 5.1 brnach by chance?
[9:26pm]PeterThoeny: yes
[9:27pm]GeorgeTrubisky: last meeting yes, unit test results were as expected (only 5 broken)
[9:28pm]GeorgeTrubisky: haven't svn up 5.1 branch in two weeks however....you want me to test
that also?
[9:28pm]PeterThoeny: yes, it is a good test
[9:28pm]GeorgeTrubisky: ok.
[9:28pm]PeterThoeny:5.1 should be clean because the twikiforms changes were done only in trunk
[9:28pm]GeorgeTrubisky: what do you expect?
[9:28pm]GeorgeTrubisky: ok
[9:29pm]PeterThoeny: this feature's bug item is
http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item6819
[9:29pm]PeterThoeny: welcome back himazu
[9:29pm]himazu: for some reason my connection to freenode wasn't working well
[9:30pm]PeterThoeny: yes, connection seems to be flaky
[9:31pm]PeterThoeny: george, let me check on code in trunk, e.g. debug
[9:31pm]GeorgeTrubisky: ok
[9:31pm]PeterThoeny: if you could run unit tests in 5.1 branch to verify that things are
kosher there would be nic
[9:31pm]PeterThoeny: "nice"
[9:32pm]GeorgeTrubisky: working on it
[9:32pm]PeterThoeny: since himazu is back, let me repeat what you missed:
[9:32pm]PeterThoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/MakeClearAttachmentsAreVersioned
[9:33pm]PeterThoeny: himazu:  do you want to commit to implement this feature?
[9:33pm]PeterThoeny: if so, set the appropriate fields
[9:33pm]PeterThoeny: i think this is a small enough proposal, good to familiarize yourself
with our release process
[9:33pm]PeterThoeny: what do you think?
[9:33pm]himazu: I agree.
[9:35pm]PeterThoeny: so please fill in the fields:  CommittedDeveloper, DateOfCommitment. ProposedFor
[9:35pm]PeterThoeny: and create a bug item, and list it in the BugTracking field as
TWikibug:ItemNNNN shortcut
[9:36pm]PeterThoeny: that way we can easily track the feature
[9:36pm]himazu: ok
[9:36pm]PeterThoeny: back to bugs
[9:37pm]PeterThoeny: in the release blockers at 
http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/ReleaseBlocker there are two items marked as being 
worked on
[9:37pm]PeterThoeny: i forgot about those
[9:37pm]PeterThoeny: i'll finish them up
[9:38pm]PeterThoeny: that is it on my side for bug review
[9:38pm]PeterThoeny: any other bug to look at?
[9:39pm]GeorgeTrubisky: wasn't clear to me the bugs you pointed out to me with the wysiwyg were
in the bug log
[9:39pm]GeorgeTrubisky: I look for them,
[9:39pm]GeorgeTrubisky: do you know if they are registered?
[9:39pm]PeterThoeny: the release blocker link i posted before only lists release blockers
[9:40pm]GeorgeTrubisky: yes
[9:40pm]PeterThoeny: ah, the ones i mentioned in the e-mail on your twiki.org edits
[9:40pm]PeterThoeny: no, they are not listed
[9:40pm]PeterThoeny: they should be filed
[9:40pm]GeorgeTrubisky: ok, I'll follow up
[9:40pm]PeterThoeny: oh, thanks
[9:40pm]PeterThoeny: if not other bug items lets go to next item
[9:40pm]PeterThoeny: ---++ 3. Miscellaneous
[9:40pm]PeterThoeny: i have one thing
[9:41pm]PeterThoeny: himazu & GeorgeTrubisky:  do you have anything?
[9:41pm]GeorgeTrubisky: I'm goood
[9:41pm]GeorgeTrubisky: good
[9:41pm]PeterThoeny: ok
[9:41pm]PeterThoeny: i'd like to discuss the 5.1.1 patch release
[9:41pm]GeorgeTrubisky: hmmm
[9:42pm]PeterThoeny: we are actully in very good shape and do not have any emergency to
release 5.1.1
[9:42pm]PeterThoeny: in fact this release has been very solid, almost too solid
[9:42pm]PeterThoeny: reminds me of the very early days of twiki
[9:43pm]PeterThoeny: there is a not so big thing that warrants a new release:
[9:43pm]PeterThoeny: the backuprestoreplugin was not 100% ready by the 5.1.0 release
[9:43pm]PeterThoeny: e.g. it needs to be updated (as documented) before it can be used to
restore a backup
[9:44pm]PeterThoeny: this issue will be fixed once we have 5.1.1
[9:44pm]PeterThoeny: and the other thing is, we released 5.1.0 in august
[9:44pm]PeterThoeny: we need a new release or risk of being seen as stale
[9:45pm]PeterThoeny: so i propose we release 5.1.1 sometimes in january
[9:45pm]PeterThoeny: what do you think?
[9:46pm]GeorgeTrubisky: well, I'll have to see if I can fit it into the first week in
January...maybe that first weekend
[9:46pm]GeorgeTrubisky: checking calendar...
[9:46pm]PeterThoeny: can be towards end of january, does not really matter
[9:46pm] himazu left the chat room. (Ping timeout:  240 seconds)
[9:47pm]GeorgeTrubisky: end of January is busy for me
[9:47pm]PeterThoeny: hmm, hideyo-san is gone again
[9:47pm]PeterThoeny: ah, ok
[9:47pm]GeorgeTrubisky: Friday 6th, and Saturday the 7th I could
[9:47pm]PeterThoeny: so anytime that is good for you
[9:47pm]GeorgeTrubisky: what's your schedule like that weekend?
[9:49pm]PeterThoeny: should be ok for me, although my mom will leave that weekend
[9:49pm] himazu joined the chat room.
[9:49pm]GeorgeTrubisky: ah, not good
[9:49pm]PeterThoeny: no, this is ok for me
[9:50pm]GeorgeTrubisky: sure?
[9:51pm]GeorgeTrubisky: ok, I've updated my calendar for 1/6 (friday)
[9:51pm]GeorgeTrubisky: Saturday ok also
[9:51pm]GeorgeTrubisky: are we going to have a release meeting on 12/29?
[9:51pm]PeterThoeny: ok, lets do it then
[9:52pm]PeterThoeny: i propose we shift the meeting
[9:52pm]PeterThoeny: and have the first one in the first week of january
[9:52pm]himazu: i'll be on vacation
[9:52pm]PeterThoeny: oic
[9:52pm]PeterThoeny: you mean in first week of jan?
[9:53pm]himazu: i mean 12/29
[9:53pm]GeorgeTrubisky: how about just go for 1/12 ?
[9:53pm]PeterThoeny: how about 1/5?
[9:53pm]GeorgeTrubisky: I'm on the road that day
[9:54pm]PeterThoeny: ok, so lets do 1/12
[9:54pm]GeorgeTrubisky: Peter, just ran the unit tests in the 5.1 branch....does not look good
[9:54pm]PeterThoeny: (or 1/13 in japan)
[9:54pm]himazu: i'll be working from Jan 5 Tokyo time.
[9:54pm]GeorgeTrubisky: it was clean 2 weeks ago
[9:55pm]GeorgeTrubisky:53 tests failed
[9:55pm]PeterThoeny: first on meeting, let's do on 1/13 (1/12 in california)
[9:56pm]GeorgeTrubisky: ok
[9:56pm]PeterThoeny: hmm, on unit tests, that is not good
[9:56pm]GeorgeTrubisky: no meeting on 12/29
[9:56pm]PeterThoeny: i am pretty sure i did only safe changes in 5.1 branch
[9:56pm]PeterThoeny: correct, no meeting on 12/29
[9:57pm]himazu: [please ignore. checking connectivity]
[9:58pm]PeterThoeny: there are 14 checkins in 5.1 branch last 2 weeks, all by someone called
PeterThoeny
[9:59pm]PeterThoeny: i'll slap the guy with a dead fish
[9:59pm]GeorgeTrubisky: lol
[9:59pm]PeterThoeny: ok, i'll review my changes
[10:00pm]PeterThoeny: ah, i see, i changed some text in register confirm, that might have
broken some unit tests
[10:00pm]PeterThoeny: i'll investigate
[10:00pm]PeterThoeny: time check:  +60 min
[10:01pm]PeterThoeny: good time to adjourn the meeting?
[10:01pm]GeorgeTrubisky: ok, well I'll try to raise you on skype on the 6th?  Sometime in the
PM, early?
[10:01pm]PeterThoeny: anything else?
[10:01pm]GeorgeTrubisky: I'll send an email when we get closer
[10:01pm]GeorgeTrubisky: for the 5.1.1 patch
[10:01pm]GeorgeTrubisky: ok
[10:01pm]PeterThoeny: yes, late pm on 1/6 is good for me
[10:02pm] himazu left the chat room. (Ping timeout:  252 seconds)
[10:02pm]GeorgeTrubisky: late?  Ok.  ttyl.  Merry Christmas Peter
[10:02pm]PeterThoeny: i put 4pm on my calendar
[10:02pm]PeterThoeny: ok?
[10:02pm] GeorgeTrubisky left the chat room. (Quit:  Leaving...)
[10:03pm] himazu joined the chat room.
[10:03pm]PeterThoeny: hi himazu we just finished the meeting
[10:03pm]himazu: ok
[10:03pm]PeterThoeny: anything you'd like to discuss?
[10:03pm]himazu: one questin.
[10:03pm]himazu: question
[10:03pm]PeterThoeny: sure
[10:03pm]himazu: how should I create a bug item?
[10:03pm]himazu: go to Bugs Web and create a new bug?
[10:04pm] GeorgeTrubisky joined the chat room.
[10:04pm]GeorgeTrubisky: yes
[10:04pm]GeorgeTrubisky:4pm
[10:04pm] GeorgeTrubisky left the chat room. (Client Quit)
[10:05pm]himazu: i mean, it's for the feature proposal
[10:06pm]PeterThoeny: yes, create a bug item at
http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/WebHome
[10:06pm]PeterThoeny: menu bugs => create new report
[10:07pm]himazu: Should it be for codebase 5.1.0?
[10:07pm]PeterThoeny: btw, we have a separate twiki for bugs on purpose:
[10:07pm]PeterThoeny: the develop.twiki.org twiki is updated automatically based on code in trunk
[10:07pm]PeterThoeny: this happens every 15 min
[10:07pm]PeterThoeny: this is a good way to test the latest code
[10:08pm]himazu: I suppose I should mention the feature proposal page on the bug report
[10:08pm]PeterThoeny: minor enhacement changes can be done for 5.1.1
[10:08pm]himazu: aha
[10:09pm]PeterThoeny: but regular enhancements should only be done in trunk
[10:09pm]PeterThoeny: in your case it is probably a trunk only feature, e.g. a jerusalemrelease
feature
[10:09pm]himazu: I need to check checkboxes of the Codebase field of the form of a bug report
[10:10pm]PeterThoeny: so codebase in bug tracker is ~twiki4, which is an unfortunate name for
trunk
[10:11pm]himazu: that means, I will leave the Codebase field blank
[10:11pm]himazu: for the time being, I leave ReleasedIn field blank as well.
[10:11pm]himazu: am I correct?
[10:12pm]himazu: sorry i was a bit late in recognizing your response.
[10:13pm]himazu: Codebase field shall have ~twiki4 checked.
[10:13pm]PeterThoeny: yes, leave the releasein blank
[10:13pm]himazu: ok
[10:14pm]PeterThoeny: anyway, don;t worry too much on fields, we can help straighten things out
[10:14pm]PeterThoeny: anything else?
[10:14pm]himazu: no
[10:14pm]PeterThoeny: ok
[10:14pm]himazu: ah, on more thing
[10:14pm]PeterThoeny: sure
[10:14pm]himazu: is there a better IRC server than freenode?
[10:15pm]himazu: it was working fine 2 weeks ago
[10:15pm]himazu: but not today.
[10:15pm]PeterThoeny: do you think it is freenode or your irc client?
[10:15pm]himazu: i'm using the same irc client and the same equipment and the same connection.
[10:15pm]PeterThoeny: hmm
[10:16pm]PeterThoeny: very stale here
[10:16pm]PeterThoeny: "vary stable"
[10:16pm]PeterThoeny: personally i do not like irc, is to archaic
[10:16pm]PeterThoeny: linkedin group chats are so much easier
[10:17pm]PeterThoeny: you never have to deal with netsplits and archaic commands
[10:17pm]himazu: why keep using irc?
[10:17pm]PeterThoeny: but freenode is the channel of choice for developers
[10:18pm]PeterThoeny: if we do not use freenode we have one channel less to recruit developers
[10:18pm]PeterThoeny: but that brings me to an idea
[10:18pm]himazu: given the number of attendees, it wouldn't so difficult switch to something else.
[10:18pm]PeterThoeny: we could keep #twiki as a general channel that is always on, and move the
release meetings to skype
[10:19pm]PeterThoeny: gosh, i said linkedin group chats before, i meant skype chats
[10:19pm]himazu: sounds good
[10:19pm]PeterThoeny: would you prefer skype?
[10:20pm]himazu: yes
[10:20pm]PeterThoeny: ok, we can propose that for next time
[10:20pm]himazu: cool
[10:20pm]himazu: thank you for the chat.
[10:20pm]himazu: shall we wrap this up?
[10:21pm]PeterThoeny: i'll post the log and update the meeting minutes
[10:21pm]PeterThoeny: have a wonderful day hideyo-san!
[10:21pm]himazu: happy holiday!
[10:21pm]PeterThoeny: off to eat some lindt chocolate
[10:22pm]himazu: what's lindt chocolate?
[10:22pm]himazu: ah, I found something by google search
[10:22pm]PeterThoeny: the best chocolate you can get
[10:23pm]himazu: ok
[10:23pm]himazu: talk to you soon. bye for now.
[10:25pm]PeterThoeny: bye
[10:28pm] himazu left the chat room. (Ping timeout:  252 seconds)