Date: January 31, 2011 12:09:04 PM PST
Subject: IstanbulMeetingLog2011x01x31.txt

[09:45am]  GeorgeTrubisky joined the chat room.
...snip...
[10:07am] peterthoeny: shall we just review the features?
[10:07am] GeorgeTrubisky: sure
[10:07am] peterthoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/IstanbulReleaseMeeting2011x01x31
[10:08am] peterthoeny: ---++ 1. Feature Requests for Istanbul Release
[10:08am] peterthoeny: AddIsValidWebAndTopicNameToTWikiFunc: now implemented
[10:08am] peterthoeny: AddWriteLogToTWikiFunc: now implemented
[10:08am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok
[10:09am] GeorgeTrubisky: this is for plugins, yes?
[10:09am] peterthoeny: BackupRestoreUtility: i did some more work
[10:09am] peterthoeny: yes, they are both for plugins
[10:09am] peterthoeny: these two items expose some more core functions to plugins via
TWiki::Func module
[10:10am] GeorgeTrubisky: I added some comments to "improve build process" and recommend we
close it
[10:10am] peterthoeny: let me look at http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/ImproveBuildProcess
[10:11am] peterthoeny: agreed, let's close it
[10:11am] GeorgeTrubisky: so who does that?
[10:12am] peterthoeny: you as release manager
[10:12am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok.  I'll figure out how to.
[10:12am] peterthoeny: you can edit the topic
[10:13am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok
[10:13am] peterthoeny: change the CurrentState form field
[10:13am] peterthoeny: probably to rejected
[10:13am] GeorgeTrubisky: right
[10:13am] peterthoeny: and set also ReasonForDecision
[10:13am] peterthoeny: either to "by release meeting" or "no committed developer"
[10:14am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok, I'll attend to it after meeting
[10:14am] peterthoeny: let's quickly look at other feature proposala
[10:14am] peterthoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/TWikiFeatureProposals
[10:14am] peterthoeny: ok
[10:15am] peterthoeny: CombineJumpBoxAndSearchBox: this is on me. i first will finish the
backup/restore utility
[10:16am] peterthoeny: OverridingNumericLists: i will work on this as well, after backup/restore
[10:17am] peterthoeny: EmptyTrash: i find this a useful feature. it needs on owner
[10:17am] peterthoeny: ReadOnlySkinMode: i posted this last week
[10:18am] peterthoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/ReadOnlySkinMode
[10:18am] peterthoeny: idea is to have a read-only mode for skin
[10:18am] peterthoeny: for example, application logic pages should not be edited by users
[10:19am] GeorgeTrubisky: I'd be willing to work on a feature like empty trash, but I don't
have my hand around the build and release process yet.
[10:19am] peterthoeny: it is possible to use access control, but hiding the edit/attach buttons
gives a visual clue to users
[10:19am] GeorgeTrubisky: I think I should focus on that first
[10:20am] peterthoeny: just go for it, it is good to learn by example. i can help out as needed
[10:20am] GeorgeTrubisky: for the empty trash?
[10:21am] peterthoeny: yes, or any other feature you'd like to tackle
[10:21am] peterthoeny: in open source you work on stuff you are interested personally
[10:22am] GeorgeTrubisky: yes, and what I'm interested in is continuous integration....there is an
old topic out there about daily build and smoke test.  That's what I wanted to discuss with you.
[10:23am] peterthoeny: the continuous integration is a big and important topic
[10:23am] peterthoeny: i am glad your interest is on this
[10:23am] GeorgeTrubisky: yeah, still have to take small steps to get going
[10:24am] peterthoeny: may be first to get started do some small feature or bug fix to learn the
process
[10:24am] peterthoeny: what do you think?
[10:24am] peterthoeny: for example, there is a bug where you can't delete the same attachment
name twice!
[10:24am] GeorgeTrubisky: that is what I wanted to seek your advise on.  So if you recommend a
small feature first, that is what I'll do.
[10:25am] GeorgeTrubisky: So that bug is documented, yes?
[10:25am] peterthoeny: so, the empty trash is not to big (although it requires template work)
[10:26am] peterthoeny: the can't delete twice bug is smaller
[10:26am] peterthoeny: to fix
[10:26am] peterthoeny: yes, it is filed
[10:26am] peterthoeny: let me find...
[10:26am] GeorgeTrubisky: I'm willing to accept your recommendation.  What I've done to prepare
the last few weeks is to complete a tutorial on perl to brush up my skills
[10:27am] peterthoeny: http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item5384
[10:27am] peterthoeny: an old bug
[10:27am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok, I would work off the trunk, correct?
[10:27am] peterthoeny: yes
[10:28am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok, I'll take it.
[10:28am] peterthoeny: with bug fixes we first to in trunk, then backport to latest production
branch, currently 5.0
[10:29am] peterthoeny: oh, thank you!
[10:29am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok.  Basic flow is I checkout, do a private build/test, then commit
back up to the trunk when ready.  I'll focus on that.
[10:30am] peterthoeny: reading Item5384, it looks way too complicated
[10:30am] peterthoeny: fix can be done much more simple
[10:31am] peterthoeny: lets do an example:
[10:31am] GeorgeTrubisky: any helps welcome
[10:31am] peterthoeny: say you are in TopicA in Sandbox web
[10:31am] peterthoeny: you have an attachment called stuff.pdf on TopicA
[10:31am] peterthoeny: now you delete stuff.pdf
[10:32am] peterthoeny: technically, this moves the attachment to Trash.TrashAttachment
[10:32am] peterthoeny: now you have Sandbox.TopicB that also has a stuff.pdf
[10:33am] peterthoeny: now you try to delete stuff.pdf from TopicB
[10:33am] peterthoeny: you get an error message that the attachment can't be moved to
Trash.TrashAttachment because it already exists at the destination
[10:33am] peterthoeny: this is a bug
[10:34am] GeorgeTrubisky: and my test case...
[10:34am] peterthoeny: actually, it makes sense if you try to move an attachment to another topic
(safety measure), but it is a bug if you want to delete an attachment
[10:34am] peterthoeny: yes, test case for delete is needed
[10:35am] GeorgeTrubisky: so one solution is just append a data/time stamp to Trash.TrashAttachment?
[10:35am] peterthoeny: yes
[10:35am] peterthoeny: either timestamp or sequential number
[10:36am] peterthoeny: i think a simple spec to make this work is: rename attachment only if move
to Trash.TrashAttachment and if destination exists
[10:36am] GeorgeTrubisky: ic
[10:37am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok, so I'll update the bug topic with that spec to start
[10:37am] peterthoeny: so in our example, if you delete stuff.pdf from Sandbox.TopicB, twiki will
move to Trash.TrashAttachment as stuff2.pdf
[10:37am] GeorgeTrubisky: yes
[10:39am] peterthoeny: time check: +40 min
[10:39am] GeorgeTrubisky: yes, I have till top of the hour
[10:39am] peterthoeny: let's close the meeting, and go to your questions
[10:40am] peterthoeny: btw, have you seen http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/TWiki/TWikiDotOrgVisitorMap ?
[10:40am]  PeterJones joined the chat room.
[10:40am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok.  Well we covered them basically.  I finished my perl tutorial studies
and was seeking direction on how to engage as release manager.  Now I'll focus on this bug as a
first step
[10:41am] peterthoeny: it shows traffic on twiki.org of 1.5 weeks
[10:41am] GeorgeTrubisky: let me look
[10:41am] peterthoeny: hi pete
[10:41am] peterthoeny: we just finished the meeting, now to informal stuff
[10:41am] peterthoeny: pete, have you seen http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/TWiki/TWikiDotOrgVisitorMap ?
[10:41am] GeorgeTrubisky: cool
[10:42am] peterthoeny: traffic on twiki.org of 1.5 weeks
[10:42am] GeorgeTrubisky: big dot in Brazil.  What company or companies?
[10:42am] peterthoeny: most of visitors from us and europe
[10:43am] peterthoeny: i guess they resolve ip address to location
[10:43am] peterthoeny: i guess they can't resolve many ip addresses in brazil beyond country name
[10:43am] peterthoeny: hence the big dot in the middle of brazil
[10:44am] PeterJones: Hello, sorry Im late
[10:44am] peterthoeny: mexico is a big user
[10:44am] PeterJones: I have seen the new world map that you mention. Very impressive
[10:45am] GeorgeTrubisky: Sao Paulo I bet for Brazil
[10:45am] peterthoeny: africa is pretty sparse
[10:46am] peterthoeny: recently i exchanged some email with someone using twiki in kampala, uganda
[10:46am] GeorgeTrubisky: Egypt will go dark soon due to current events!
[10:47am] peterthoeny: it already went dark, internet shut off
...snip...
[11:00am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok, got a hard stop.  Got to go.  Talk with you later!
[11:01am] peterthoeny: nice chatting w you!
[11:01am] peterthoeny: ttyl george
[11:01am]  GeorgeTrubisky left the chat room. (Quit: Leaving...)
[11:03am] peterthoeny: pete, what's new?
[11:04am] peterthoeny: i tested now over 200 plugins for twiki-5.0
[11:04am] peterthoeny: i will check in 6 more plugins tomorrow
[11:04am] peterthoeny: how is testing on math mode coming along?
[11:05am] PeterJones: Ive been busy with SVN recently
[11:05am] PeterJones: I have looked into the Attachment rollback feature but its nit ready yet
[11:06am] peterthoeny: ok
[11:07am] peterthoeny: svn, cern related?
[11:07am] PeterJones: Its for our current TWiki installation
[11:08am] peterthoeny: still on 4.3?
[11:08am] PeterJones: Yes still on 4.3 and will move to 5.1
[11:08am] peterthoeny: ah, skip 5.0?
[11:09am] PeterJones: Yes we are not quite ready for 5.0
[11:11am] peterthoeny: mainly due to math mode and other plugins?
[11:12am] PeterJones: Yes those plgins amongst other things. 4.3 is stable here
[11:12am] PeterJones: I need to be sure that the Math plugins work ok as they are heavily used here
[11:13am] peterthoeny: a necessity
[11:13am] PeterJones: Yes they are used for formulaes etc
[11:13am] peterthoeny: btw, a long time ago we talked about a twiki success story of cern
[11:14am] peterthoeny: can we revisit this?
[11:14am] PeterJones: Sure I will look into thuis
[11:14am] peterthoeny: more publicity for the twiki project will help attract new contributors
[11:14am] peterthoeny: we are way way to small community right now
[11:15am] peterthoeny: so anything that helps attract new contributors is important at this stage
[11:15am] peterthoeny: if have to go now
[11:15am] peterthoeny: other meeting coming up at work
[11:16am] PeterJones: ok see you  next time
[11:16am] peterthoeny: ttyl pete