Date: January 17, 2011 12:18:21 PM PST
Subject: IstanbulMeetingLog2011x01x17.txt

[09:53am]  peterthoeny rejoined the room.
[10:00am] peterthoeny: good morning george!
[10:03am] GeorgeTrubisky: Good Morning Peter
[10:03am] peterthoeny: did you have a nice weekend?
[10:04am] GeorgeTrubisky: hmmm, technical difficulties, just a minute
[10:04am]  PeterJones joined the chat room.
[10:04am] peterthoeny: hi pete!
[10:05am]  GeorgeTrubisky left the chat room. (Remote host closed the connection)
[10:05am] peterthoeny: still cold in my home country?
[10:05am]  GeorgeTrubisky joined the chat room.
[10:05am] GeorgeTrubisky: I'm back
[10:05am] peterthoeny: ok
[10:05am] GeorgeTrubisky: Good Morning Peter
[10:06am] PeterJones: Goood Evening
[10:06am] peterthoeny: on saturday i went to West Coast Community Leadership Summit
[10:07am] peterthoeny: http://clswest.blogspot.com/
[10:07am] peterthoeny: was interesting to mingle with and learn from online community leaders
[10:08am] GeorgeTrubisky: top of the hill, Daly City!
[10:09am] peterthoeny: yea, at devry university, which is almost in san francisco (edge of
daly city)
[10:10am] peterthoeny: when i find time i will write a blog about the event
[10:10am] peterthoeny: one session was very good on the history of online communities,
starting from bbses
[10:11am] GeorgeTrubisky: focus is on building community I see...looks good
[10:11am] peterthoeny: yes
[10:12am] peterthoeny: funny thing is it looks like we are doing all the right things, but
for some reason we have a hard time to recruit more contributors
[10:13am] GeorgeTrubisky: takes a while to build up to a critical mass.
[10:14am] GeorgeTrubisky: update on Sopan:  Wrote to him after last release meeting concerning
failures in unit and automated tests, he said he would get back to me but never did.
[10:14am] GeorgeTrubisky: So I've just proceeded on my own
[10:14am] peterthoeny: yes, that is the point, once you have 5-10 people contributing (ideas,
learning experiences, specs, feedback to specs, code, docs, adovcacy, etc) on a daily basis
new people are drawn to it
[10:15am] peterthoeny: on sopan, it is hard to get hold of him recently
[10:15am] peterthoeny: last week i talked to him on irc
[10:15am] peterthoeny: he said that he gave you svn access when you requested (but he never
posted that on twiki.org)
[10:16am] PeterJones: I think Sopan is travelling
[10:16am] peterthoeny: george, if you have any build questions i will try to answer as good as
i can
[10:16am] peterthoeny: yes, sopan is on the road a lot
[10:17am] GeorgeTrubisky: I looked at the code for the failures, quickly found my perl skills
were not up to the task, so I've been plowing through a perl tutorial.  I still plan to debug
them.
[10:18am] peterthoeny: let's start with agenda
[10:18am] peterthoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/IstanbulReleaseMeeting2011x01x17
[10:18am] peterthoeny: # 1. Feature Requests for Istanbul Release
[10:18am] peterthoeny: # 2. Review Urgent and Not So Urgent Bugs
[10:18am] peterthoeny: # 3. Miscellaneous
[10:18am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok, thanks for the offer.  I should be finished with the tutorial
soon, so I'll turn my attention back to the debug task.
[10:18am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok
[10:19am] peterthoeny: we are only 3 today, so let's make this flexible and a bit free form
[10:19am] peterthoeny: ---++ 1. Feature Requests for Istanbul Release
[10:19am] peterthoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/TWikiFeatureProposals
[10:20am] peterthoeny: DontHideNonHiddenAttachments: is now done
[10:21am] peterthoeny: AddIsValidWebAndTopicNameToTWikiFunc: i posted this a week ago
[10:21am] peterthoeny: basically add two system functions to the twiki::func api
[10:21am] peterthoeny: mainly for ease of use for plugin developers
[10:21am] peterthoeny: to add isValidWebName and isValidTopicName to TWiki::Func
[10:22am] peterthoeny: i will implement this week (small thing)
[10:22am] peterthoeny: pete i have seen that you updated:
[10:22am] peterthoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/RollbackAttachmentVersion
[10:22am] peterthoeny: can you give a summary?
[10:23am] PeterJones: Yes Ive been looking at this.
[10:23am] PeterJones: I think the best approach is to copy a particular version of an attachment
and then attch that version back into the topic
[10:24am] PeterJones: This will force a new version and keep all the others.
[10:24am] peterthoeny: that looks like a good plan
[10:25am] PeterJones: Once I have the optimal methd the template can be done based on the
rollback Topic one
[10:25am] peterthoeny: as for ui, i am still not all clear
[10:25am] peterthoeny: what is clear is that the version hostory table that lists all versions
of an attachments has an action row with _view_ link in each row
[10:26am] PeterJones: In manage Attachments there can be a option to rollback. Either default
to rollback to previous version with a GET link.
[10:26am] PeterJones: Or use a small form for a particular version as done with teh topic rollback
[10:26am] peterthoeny: so we plan to add one more link to get: _view_, _restore_
[10:27am] PeterJones: One more link would mean rollback to previous version
[10:27am] peterthoeny: where does the _restore_ link lead to?
[10:28am] PeterJones: The attach method would be the last thing used so the user would be
taken back to the topic
[10:28am] PeterJones: I will try out a few scenarios
[10:28am] peterthoeny: look at
[10:28am] peterthoeny: http://twiki.org/p/pub/Codev/RollbackAttachmentVersion/TWikiAttachmentManage.jpg
[10:28am] PeterJones: There is no rush for this but I intend to get it done
[10:29am] peterthoeny: this example has two attachments
[10:29am] peterthoeny: the propsal has this: "In the Action column the actions could be view,
restore"
[10:30am] peterthoeny: i like the idea of adding the restore link there
[10:30am] PeterJones: Ok, restore could either go to another form or rollback 1 version
[10:30am] peterthoeny: but i am not clear what happens when you follow the link
[10:30am] peterthoeny: does it roll back immediately? is there a confirmation screen?
[10:31am] PeterJones: Restore would then co a copy of that version and then attach it as a new
version
[10:31am] peterthoeny: i am clear on the actual action
[10:32am] peterthoeny: but i am not clear on user interface
[10:32am] PeterJones: I will try and set something up this week.
[10:33am] peterthoeny: ok, nice
[10:33am] peterthoeny: my feedback: make it easy for user (point and click)
[10:34am] peterthoeny: and make it safe to avoid unintended rollbacks
[10:34am] PeterJones: Ok I will get back to you all on this
[10:34am] peterthoeny: next:
[10:34am] peterthoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/AddWriteLogToTWikiFunc
[10:35am] peterthoeny: i proposed last week
[10:35am] peterthoeny: plugins currently have no official way to add a log entry
[10:35am] peterthoeny: this proposal fixes it
[10:36am] peterthoeny: small item (already implemenetd in core, only need to add to twiki::func)
so i will do this feature probably this week
[10:36am] peterthoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/BackupRestoreUtility
[10:36am] peterthoeny: twiki has been known to be hard to upgrade
[10:37am] peterthoeny: the backup/restore utility is a proposal to address this, and at the same
time to add a good backup solution
[10:38am] peterthoeny: i invite you to look at the spec and provide feedback
[10:38am] GeorgeTrubisky: ok
[10:38am] peterthoeny: i think this is a major & noteworthy feature of upcoming twiki-5.1
[10:39am] peterthoeny: i actually already started to implement this as a plugin
[10:39am] peterthoeny: the reason to do as a plugin is to be able to install in older release to
create a backup for upgrade to newer twiki
[10:40am] peterthoeny: i implemented the skeleton and the low level functions
[10:40am] peterthoeny: about 25% done
[10:40am] GeorgeTrubisky: as a default plugin?
[10:40am] peterthoeny: user interface is pending
[10:40am] peterthoeny: yes, i think this should be a default plugin
[10:40am] GeorgeTrubisky: yup
[10:40am] PeterJones: what commands are involved
[10:41am] peterthoeny: reason for default plugin is not so much the upgrade, but the backup
feature
[10:41am] PeterJones: I mean on the OS level
[10:41am] peterthoeny: there will be a standalone script intended for cron
[10:41am] peterthoeny: all it does is to create a new backup in a designated directory
[10:42am] peterthoeny: all other functions are web based
[10:42am] PeterJones: Using what ? rsync, tar, cpio /
[10:42am] peterthoeny: you can specify the backup dir
[10:42am] peterthoeny: it can be local or remote on an nfs dir
[10:43am] peterthoeny: if local you can do the backup, then on success, do a scp, rsync or
whatever you like
[10:43am] peterthoeny: to copy it to a remote server
[10:43am] PeterJones: ok
[10:44am] peterthoeny: please look at ui as documented at:
[10:44am] peterthoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/BackupRestoreUtility#Console_Screen
[10:44am] peterthoeny: any feedback? missing functionality? idea on how to improve the ui?
[10:46am] PeterJones: Can it restore a paricular file only on a particular date?
[10:47am] peterthoeny: i have not planned for file level restore
[10:47am] peterthoeny: just at web level
[10:49am] peterthoeny: but good idea for file level restore
[10:49am] peterthoeny: for later version
[10:50am] peterthoeny: that are all the proposals i wanted to cover
[10:50am] PeterJones: ok i think that is already a big step forward
[10:51am] peterthoeny: pete, please add your feedback on file level restore to the proposal
[10:51am] peterthoeny: if you look at the big list of proposals, any other one to discuss?
[10:51am] peterthoeny: any ideas for new proposal?
[10:52am]  plj joined the chat room.
[10:52am]  PeterJones left the chat room. (Read error: Operation timed out)
[10:52am]  plj left the chat room. (Client Quit)
[10:52am]  plj joined the chat room.
[10:53am] peterthoeny: seems like pete has some irc issues
[10:53am] peterthoeny: plj = peterjones?
[10:55am] peterthoeny: plj:  here?
[10:55am] peterthoeny: GeorgeTrubisky:  still here?
[10:55am] GeorgeTrubisky: yes
[10:55am] peterthoeny: ok
[10:55am] peterthoeny: seems like we lost pete
[10:56am] GeorgeTrubisky: plj, are you here for the release meeting?
[10:56am] plj: Im back
[10:56am] peterthoeny: george, if you have an idea for new feature go ahed and post
[10:56am] peterthoeny: welcome back pete
[10:56am] peterthoeny: what is the last thing you could read?
[10:58am] plj: I saw you reply to the features of the restore
[10:59am] peterthoeny: plj:  please post your comment on file level restore to the proposal topic
[11:00am] peterthoeny: time check: +60 min
[11:00am] peterthoeny: ---++ 2. Review Urgent and Not So Urgent Bugs
[11:00am] peterthoeny: lets skip this
[11:00am] peterthoeny: ---++ 3. Miscellaneous
[11:00am] peterthoeny: anything?
[11:01am] peterthoeny: i have one item:
[11:01am] plj: I have nothing else
[11:01am] peterthoeny: i continue testing and fixing plugins on an almost daily basis
[11:02am] peterthoeny: we are now at 187 extensions tested on twiki-5.0
[11:02am] peterthoeny: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/SearchExtensions?qs=.&qt=AddOn|Contrib|Plugin|Skin&qv=5.0
[11:02am] peterthoeny: last night i tested http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/FluidPivotsPlugin
[11:02am] peterthoeny: that is an interesting plugin i did not remember we had
[11:03am] peterthoeny: it supports pivot tables
[11:03am] peterthoeny: e.g. create a new table based on another twiki table
[11:03am] peterthoeny: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pivot_table
[11:05am] peterthoeny: plj:  i invite you to test the plugins you need for cern, such as the
math mode plugin
[11:07am] peterthoeny: ok, this is all i had
[11:07am] peterthoeny: thank you george and pete!
[11:07am] GeorgeTrubisky: your welcome.  Thank you.
[11:07am] peterthoeny: i'll post the minutes and the log
[11:08am] peterthoeny: ttyl
[11:08am] peterthoeny: happy twiki'ing!
[11:08am]  GeorgeTrubisky left the chat room. ("Leaving...")
[11:08am] plj: ok see you
[11:08am]  plj left the chat room. (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
[11:26am]  peterthoeny left the chat by being disconnected from the server.