Session Start: Mon Sep 24 22:13:44 2007 Session Ident: #twiki_release [22:13] * Now talking in #twiki_release [22:14] hi kenneth [22:14] kenneth, do you want to take the notes? [22:14] Hello again. Yes I can do that as usual [22:14] or anyone else? [22:14] ok, thanks [22:15] nobody is asking for facilitating? [22:15] i can do that again [22:15] * gmc is in exhausted mode [22:15] * PeterThoeny time for beer? [22:16] no action items from last time [22:16] THAT was a good idea. BB in 30 seconds [22:16] ok, 30 sec break :-) [22:16] in the mean time, let me post items [22:16] ---+ 1. Review Urgent Bugs [22:17] release blockers: http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/AllOutStandingItems?class=.*&=&sortcol=3;table=1;up=1#Release_blockers [22:18] http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/ReleaseBlocker ? [22:18] * Lavr_ has joined #twiki_release [22:18] Also changed computer [22:19] yes, that is a better link [22:19] closer to the fridge ;-) [22:19] although the bugs shown differ between them [22:19] before we go through the list i would like to thank all who made the beta 1 release happen [22:19] especially sven and kenneth [22:20] and crawford, arthur and all other who do a lot of checkin work [22:20] I also noticed that we have some new bug reporters that mention that the daily builds now makes them able to test during development. [22:20] lars, and quick feedback on beta 1? [22:20] So Sven's daily is really adding value [22:21] very glad for the beta :) Ihave only that one reported 'bug' thats very bad for workflow plugin [22:22] in http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/ReleaseBlocker we have 19 blockers [22:22] i don't think we should go through all [22:22] We have quite a high number of urgent bugs now. But that could be expected right after a beta release with new people testing [22:22] kenneth as release mgr, do you want to pick some? [22:22] Let me pick a few - one moment [22:22] those items that need coordination or special attention [22:23] Item4714 - seems new. I have not yet confirmed if it is a bugs only problem [22:23] time check: +22 min [22:23] Item4714 Cannot add an Item for here on bugs and form disappeared from 4706 [22:23] http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item4714 [22:24] worse. I cannot add it again [22:24] my fault; I was doing low-level mucking with it [22:24] 4714 is a non-bug [22:24] The disappearance could be a SVN update glitch. But the fact I cannot add it again is worrying [22:24] Looks like a template problem [22:24] remove the tags and try again [22:25] I cannot add a form to a new topic on Bugs either [22:25] no - stop - it is fixed, it is not a problem, move on [22:25] oh [22:25] oh, that's different [22:25] but you can in littertray or? [22:26] yes. There is some HTML tags in the name of the form [22:26] can we move on and come back to this? [22:26] I did not have time to try on my own TWiki or in Littertray. Again looks like a template problem [22:27] so: kenneth provide feedback, crawford looks into fixing it? [22:27] 4701 TMCE adds space between TABLE tag and table seems serios [22:27] (if needed) [22:27] http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item4701 [22:27] http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/WebPreferences?raw=on has * Set WEBFORMS = ItemTemplate [22:28] looks like the culprit [22:28] Ah. OK. [22:28] Bugs issue then. Fix and close. [22:28] WebPreferences was probably edited with TMCE is an illness period. [22:29] is there some way to do a "raw diff"? [22:29] We covered the TMCE styles usability. Obviously we need ideas for this one [22:29] * ketty has joined #twiki_release [22:29] CDot: The more screen has options, but not a raw per se [22:30] n.m. I'll command-line it [22:30] thx [22:30] ("debug" is closest match, i.e. http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/rdiff/Bugs/WebPreferences?rev2=46&rev1=47&render=debug) [22:30] one of those things [22:30] * ketty has left #twiki_release [22:31] Item4656. When the verbatim/literal eat newlines thing we discussed earlier is fixed - then I will change Item4656 using literal round the HTML before and after the bullets. [22:31] hi ketty: welcome to our meeting. we are in the middle of reviewing urgent bug items, http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/ReleaseBlocker [22:31] http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item4656 [22:32] time check: +30 min [22:32] Item4700 - Tables and TMCE (especially the merging of table cells. I guess Crawford has a good challenge in that one. [22:32] lets spend no more than 10 more minutes on bug review [22:32] http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item4700 [22:32] http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item3668 - a bug , but maybe not really urgent release blocker? [22:33] Anyone against lowering to normal? [22:33] I imagibne Jacek would be... [22:34] probably not to hard to fix [22:35] although bad, i would not block 4.2.0 with this item [22:35] No because it is only in certain cases and there is a work around. If someone wants to fix it anyway nothing prevents them. [22:36] http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item4681 Great flash of css bug. Strange bug. Is it urgent? Is it safari only? [22:36] Seems not urgent to me. [22:36] I don;t see it on Windows [22:37] And I do not see it in FF or IE6 or IE7 on windows either. Normal then. Can someone edit as we continue? [22:37] I haven't seen it on Safari either [22:37] I was looking for a better example page [22:38] time check: +38 min (2 more min for bug review) [22:38] http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item4683 - is a normal bug in my view - not urgent - very special case. [22:39] http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item4576 - Koen - are you fixing in a not so distant future? [22:39] yes i am [22:39] probably tomorrow [22:39] 4683 is normal as far as i am concerned [22:40] normal bug, yes [22:40] thanks koen [22:40] http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item4523 - the XSS bug - we seems to have a concensus that fixing this in 4.2.0 will mean a bad fix. It is deferred to 4.2.1. I will however write a section about XSS in the release note to show the world that we care about it [22:41] agreed, good move [22:41] +40 min [22:41] any last item kenneth? [22:42] Item4671: default skin is a bit broken - I wonder if the many checkins has fixed the important parts. I personally only test in Pattern skin [22:42] I think we also are not agreeing what should be in the default skin [22:42] I use default skin in one of my dev twikis (the one on Windows) [22:42] i.e. a colored top bar [22:42] and I find it OK [22:43] Sven - when you read minutes - close bug if you are done [22:43] meanwhile I am not sure if Classic skin is up to date [22:43] BTW we are down to 6 unit test failures on Windows and OSX now. And they are probably unfixable. [22:43] http://develop.twiki.org/~twiki4/cgi-bin/view/Bugs/Item4670 - Is this such a big deal? [22:44] it's naff, but not urgent [22:44] not urgent [22:44] Yes. If someone changes password and closes the browser and did not need to. No whales will be harmed from that [22:44] possible doc fix only? [22:44] is it needed, to close the browser? [22:45] Apache authentication - yes. template - no [22:45] I mean, you should open it again? [22:45] and revisit the site [22:45] the text in the dialog should state both cases, or do conditional text [22:45] hey I closed my browser, and nothing happens! [22:46] You cannot log out of Apache auth. So to reauth as with new password you have to close and open new [22:46] lets move on [22:46] ---+ 2. Coordinate TWiki Release 4.2 [22:46] beta 1 is out [22:47] looking at the current state, shall we shoot for beta 2 or rc1? [22:47] I think we need a beta 2 before we can go RC1. There are quite a few urgent bugs and more to come. [22:47] But the beta2 should be soon. Maybe a week from now [22:47] ok [22:47] sounds reasonable [22:48] beta 2: 2007-10-01 [22:48] rc1: 2007-10-15 (if all goes well) [22:49] I made a manual audit of all checkins since the branch off of 4.2 - and I was impressed. Noone forgot to sync over. Two checkins were not because of pending decision to merge. Very well done everyone [22:49] production: 2007-11-29 (best case) [22:49] You mean 2007-10-29 right? [22:49] oops, yes [22:50] Sounds like a fair conservative estimate. [22:50] When should the translations be final? [22:50] meaning 2 weeks intervals [22:51] there has been no decision on driving the language into TMCE, I assume we are dropping that idea? [22:51] i think it is optimistic estimate (if no major showstoppers found that canno be fixed quickly) [22:51] Note that now we are branched people can add new features to MAIN only! But it is nice to see that people really focus on 4.2.0. Thank you for that. [22:52] crawford, lets discuss in a minute [22:52] first, [22:52] CDot. I agree. Getting TMCE stable should be the target for 4.2.0. Especially now that you are again working unfunded. [22:52] when shall we alert the translators to do the final translation? [22:53] (cdot: lets take the funding offline) [22:53] on translators: should rc1 have/not have translations? [22:54] s/translations/updated translations/ [22:54] I think beta 2 in one week should mark the final string freeze. [22:54] Including TMCE [22:55] translation fixes could be done between rc1 and production (they are safe to do) [22:56] Anyone have an idea what the gap is now between what is translated and what needs to be done? [22:56] i'd perfer to move the transations closer to release so that we have an up to date translations [22:56] http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/TWikiTranslationStatus [22:57] last update 2007-09-09 by antonio [22:57] i'd say string freeze by rc1 [22:57] not beta2 [22:57] so that we have more time for text work [22:58] i have to sign off now [22:58] please continue [22:58] i'll read the log [22:58] w.r.t to the broken forms, i think i know what happened [22:59] Arthur (quite rightly) deleted a spurious that was in the topic text [22:59] and TMCE in it's wisdom realised there was an unclose

fuurther up [23:00] so it closed it..... [23:00] in the worng place :-( [23:01] that's the sort of "usability issue" we will always have until we store HTML [23:01] well. that sort of errors we probably have to live with [23:03] I am still here with an half ear, frantically trying to finish something promised to be finished [23:03] (trying to catch up on the minutes - that is why I am silent) [23:06] so, i guess we are finished then? [23:06] Well. we are out of agenda points. One remark. I reviewed the new proposals. Only one new committed and that is Koen. [23:06] But there were 3 "concerners" so 14-day clock has stopped. [23:06] Koen are you OK to defer decision to later or will you re-write the proposal? [23:06] Pauline may commit me to the extension to formfield() [23:07] cool. [23:07] gmc ping [23:07] pong [23:08] discussion later is fine with me [23:08] erm, one point not on the agenda [23:08] it would be really nice if people could provide feedback [23:08] on the bugs in "Waiting for Feedback" [23:08] Good. working more on it may be a good idea because it smells like a No vote based on the concern raised [23:08] even if they are not waitong for you [23:09] * Seriow has joined #twiki_release [23:09] * Seriow has left #twiki_release [23:10] OK. I think we have reached the end. [23:10] super [23:10] :-) [23:10] I look forward to lots of testcases, and high quality feedback [23:11] We look forward to a lot of Waiting for Release and Closed :-) [23:11] you can dream, same as me [23:12] of to bed then.. for all that dreaming.. [23:12] zzzzzz [23:12] * LarsEik has left #twiki_release ("Ex-Chat")